John van der Pflum

Dave,

You wanted to know what I am doing differently for my short game
improvement. I have almost completely abandoned the pitch shot[1] and
gone to a chip/bump and run type shot.

I have found that the margin for error on the bump and run is much
higher. Fat shots still pretty much suck all the way around but thin
shots tend to stay on the green and then at least I am putting instead
of chipping again. Also, the shots rolling along the ground have a
much better chance of going in than via a more lofty shot.

I used to use my 58* and 52* clubs for 80% of my shots around the
green. I now use my PW for 70% and 8I for 20% with the remaining
taken up with the high risk/low return flop shots.

Hope that helps.

[1] except of course in cases where I am extremely short sided or have
to go over a bunker or such.

Tom Yost

John van der Pflum <> wrote in
news::

> Dave,
>
> You wanted to know what I am doing differently for my short game
> improvement. I have almost completely abandoned the pitch shot[1] and
> gone to a chip/bump and run type shot.
>
> I have found that the margin for error on the bump and run is much
> higher.
> ...

?

Helps you keep focused, I guess.

John van der Pflum

On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 16:17:14 +0000 (UTC), Tom Yost <>
wrote:

>John van der Pflum <> wrote in
>news::
>
>> Dave,
>>
>> You wanted to know what I am doing differently for my short game
>> improvement. I have almost completely abandoned the pitch shot[1] and
>> gone to a chip/bump and run type shot.
>>
>> I have found that the margin for error on the bump and run is much
>> higher.
>> ...
>
>?
>
>Helps you keep focused, I guess.

No -- hitting the bump and run is EASIER than the flop/pitch shot.

Fairway

On Oct 2, 10:03 am, John van der Pflum <nowhammymyspa...@bite.org>
wrote:
>> No -- hitting the bump and run is EASIER than the flop/pitch shot.  
Agreed. On most I find the bump and run shot far easier to gauge than
the pitch. The 8i is my favorite, sometimes the situation calls for
other clubs. I think, btw, that the fairways tend to be a bit harder
in Europe than in USA. F

Dugjustdug

On Oct 2, 11:49 am, Fairway <armins...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Oct 2, 10:03 am, John van der Pflum <nowhammymyspa...@bite.org>
> wrote:>> No -- hitting the bump and run is EASIER than the flop/pitch shot.  
>
> Agreed. On most I find the bump and run shot  far easier to gauge than
> the pitch. The 8i is my favorite, sometimes the situation calls for
> other clubs. I think, btw, that the fairways tend to be a bit harder
> in Europe than in USA. F

No doubt. And on sandy soil (examples close to my house are Pacific
Dunes & Chambers Bay), I am hauling out my putter for anything 30
yards and in (barring any obstructions). If I have opportunity to
play in UK, I fully intend to have the Texas Flat Wedge out when I'm
near the green.

Loudon Briggs

John van der Pflum <> wrote:

>On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 16:17:14 +0000 (UTC), Tom Yost <>
>wrote:
>
>>John van der Pflum <> wrote in
>>news::
>>
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> You wanted to know what I am doing differently for my short game
>>> improvement. I have almost completely abandoned the pitch shot[1] and
>>> gone to a chip/bump and run type shot.
>>>
>>> I have found that the margin for error on the bump and run is much
>>> higher.
>>> ...
>>
>>?
>>
>>Helps you keep focused, I guess.
>
>No -- hitting the bump and run is EASIER than the flop/pitch shot.

Absolutely! What I can't understand is how many of the pros will use a
deep wedge from 1 or 2 feet off of the green. Fairly often, they
barely make the putting surface, if at all. That shot can be done
with a 3 or 4 iron, grip down and use as a putter... same stroke,
misses all, or most of the fringe, and rolls like a putt... one of the
easiest shots to perfect.

Pete Z

On Oct 3, 12:23 pm, newellsatwsu <newellat...@adelphia.net> wrote:
> On Oct 3, 6:46 am, John van der Pflum <nowhammymyspa...@bite.org>
> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 03 Oct 2008 06:28:44 -0700, Tom Yost <t...@bloodyvikings.com>
> > wrote:
> > >>No -- hitting the bump and run is EASIER than the flop/pitch shot.  
>
> > >Well, I agree with you there. I don't even carry a 60 deg wedge.
>
> > >I was thinking you had misapplied the term "margin for error," but I'm
> > >confused...
>
> > When I think of "margin for error" I take it to mean that if you make
> > an error it doesn't hurt you as much.  I can see how it could be
> > interpreted to mean "easier to make an error".  
>
> Yes, I take it as the 2nd....small/less margin for error = harder
> shot.  I believe, in the right circumstances, the bump and run has a
> larger margin for error.  Hit it a little fat and it runs out...a
> little skinny--same thing.  Basically the more loft you need on a shot
> the more exacting you (1) have to hit it cleanly to produce the needed
> spin, trajectory, carry, line, etc.  The b&r with less loft (7i-PW)
> takes much of the spin, trajectory, carry out of the equation in terms
> of just getting the ball on the green - which is what you said you
> were trying to do...just get a chance to one-putt it.

Instead of being pseudo-intellectual, why not just say, less chance
for drastic error. :-)

Margin of error is a statistical term having to do with things like
opinion polls. If the margin of error is higher, the pollster
is less confident in theresults. E. g. If Obama is leading McCain by
10 points, but the margin of error is 20 %, that is meaningless,
but if the margin of error is 1%, Obama can start hiring caterers
for the inauguration.

BTW, it depends on the type of chip, and topography and speed
of the greens, as to which type of chip is easier. For example,
if you have to chip over 3 different breaks, which would be easier,
a 58 degree lofted shot, running the last 10 feet, or a chip
running 40 feet through the three breaks, and different levels?